Category: Let's talk
I'm kicking things off with a video set that was in my VERY FIRST POST of the PREVIOUS forum, because there've been ADDITIONAL UPDATES, and of COURSE, there are those that have ALREADY been posted within that SAME SET that you might've already seen, whether or not you remember SEEING them, and if I happen to find any MORE ABSOLUTE-TRUTH-BASED video sets for THIS post, I'll include them.
OOPS! Oh, well--I didn't mean to post the PREVIOUS message without the VIDEO-POSTS, but I may as well post them HERE:
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLtfZcSCyYFN2SANwBfwRfpzjwhBHHTRLe
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL1mzSRO0dbhUYJoYLRxZBACzRQMMsxnFF
http://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLUW0Yheypp-BXX3ntBhd2-0bVoSkMblni
Well now, Terrance, Does Jesus watch you go poopy?
Does Jesus watch you fuck? Or get fucked?
The Landover Baptists need to do a vid on that, too.
Hmm. Well, if they're into gay porn. Next time it happens I should just go ahead and do a vid.
GOD is NOT MOCKED. Remember that.
God isn't mocked, that's for sure... that doesn't mean that you're not going to
be mocked.
Frankly it's the only reason I bother visiting these posts -- to mock the OP.
So for the curious and the questioning:
What sense does it make for a deity, presumably far greater than we are, presumably so great that we are insignificant to it, for that deity to care two hoots as to whether it is "mocked" by us or not? How exactly does a single ant mock a human being? How does a microbe mock a human being? Which do you think is more moral: to squish the ant and be done with it, or to pull its legs off, keep it alive and torture it forever?
But the god is supposed to be greater than us, in far greater proportions than we are greater than ants, or even microbes.
Hmm, I would love to be part of an artificial intelligence project someday. But, if I am, I won't make it to sing my praises or bow and scrape to me. And when we accidentally introduce a bug into software, the software is not punished. We are the responsible parties, as the designers, to fix it.
The artificial intelligence debates are no different: How do we, the designers, deal with certain constraints, or lack thereof, or challenges.
Totally backwards from how the god allegedly did things.
In a modern context, a similar myth might look like:
And the god created iPhone. iPhone did not perform up to the god's expectations, so the god created a place to throw the iPhone, where it would simultaneously be melted but not ever melt away. Parenthetically, it would take more from the god to create such a place than it would to create the iPhone itself. Should tell you something about the god.
But as humans, of course, when something isn't right, we refactor, a technical word meaning we rewrite parts of its software.
So perhaps the god is not mocked, just as you are not mocked by the ant or the microbe. Perhaps, then, if we get in its way, we stand a chance of being squished or terminated, just as we squish ants and terminate microbes. But we don't torture ants forever and ever for not bowing down to us. Parenthetically, how would an ant meaningfully bow down to you? It's so close to the ground, compared to you, that that would be a distinction without a difference. How woud you bow down to the god? Since you're already at ground level and the god is theoretically outside of spacetime, according to the latest from your apologists.
The concept is totally meaningless if you at all think about it. How is a virus, like the ebola virus, going to self-efface before you? It is such a pathetic thing compared to you: You can run around in the open air in any number of temperatures, invent things, carry on living. While Mr. Ebola, the alleged scurge against us atheists, if you believe the eminent Rick Wilds, that pathetic, piddly little virus thing can't do anything to fight you, except if it is allowed in under some very specific and narrow conditions. And then, it has to use your cells to do it, and even then, it is so weak and stupid it kills you before it can meaningfully propagate itself in most cases. So how would Mr. Ebola possibly be able to self-efface before you. And, according to the Christians the difference between you and Mr. Ebola is far far smaller than difference between the god and one of us carbon-based m"bags of mostly water".
So, doing anything meaningful or harmful to a god is totally impossible. The Christians say we are nothing compared to the god, the god had no real need of us. Well, something that is next to nothing in comparison to you cannot "mock" you, insult you, or damage your ego unless you're the most fragile and insecure.
What grown man, with any sense of honor, is insulted by the antics of a mentally challenged person? What grown man is insulted by a teenager or a child? Annoyed, yes. But insulted, to the point of outrage? To the point where you would torture that other being forever and ever?
Check the possibility of this even happening with a god.
Or, wait and see if you can find a way for that cold and flu virus to prostrate itself before you. Because to it, if it was self-aware, you would be like a god. How could that tiny piddly little sugar ant possibly bow down to you. Here you are, standing tall and strong, and there it is, barely visible to you on the floor; you could squash it with your toe! you don't care if it calls you a douchebag or what it thinks of you. You're a king kong god to that ant. What would we say of a grown man who was insulted and outraged by what a tiny little sugar ant thought of him?
Wow Leo, that was a whole lot of words and time spent for the minor answers you'll probably receive, and the five unrelated links you might get from Terrence.
What I got out of that is you're asking how God, whom we are told is so far above us we can't even fathom, can feel mocked by us insignificant beings? Am I right? Leo, from your writing and the experiences you've shared, it sounds like you've got a very particular view of God. Well, so do I. To that end:
Short LDS answer: we are not insignificant to him. God is the father; he is our father. He has given life to our spirits, clothed us in mortality and given us dominion over a world created by him and his son to be a place in which we may dwell. He wants us to experience mortality, and also to live in such a manner that we may return to where we came from to dwell with him. He clothes us, sustains us and gives us guidelines or rules to follow. The relationship we have is not all that different from that of an earthly parent and child. I think as our parents are so much more above us in ability and development than we are as infants and even young children, So is god above us, his children. From an eternal perspective, we are quite small at this time. But that does not mean we are less to him. Now if all this is true; if you can believe it, then is it so hard to also believe that he would get upset if a child he loved and knows so well mocked his very existence; made jokes about him; ridiculed him? How would you feel if one of your children did that to you: flew in the face of everything you tried to teach him; spit on everything you tried to do for them.
Blah blah blah.
You know imp, but for your contempt I'd almost think you were more interested in all these conversations than you let on. you sure hang around a lot.
Well, thanks for the responses, BG.
All I can say in answer is the following: My daughter needs no apologetics books to demonstrate my existence to her. If she has an experience with me, she needs no ancient text to perform analysis on in ordewr to prove if this experience was from her father or a deception of mind or some other competitor for her attention. To the absentee father, belief that he cares is paramount, because there is no tangible evidence of his being a father or being there.
As to whether or not I get upset when she does something hurtful to herself? Of course. But my ego is not injured. My concern for her is paramount. When she did things I found heartbreaking as a teenager, like snub or ignore me or find the old man an embarrassment, or be afraid others might stare, it was hurtful to me, yes. But never was I outraged at her. In fact, when performing as a father, there is a significant amount of self-doubt as to how well you're doing, or how what you're doing is going to impact the child, for good or for ill. It may explain the god's need for adoration and praise in some contexts, I suppose. But I don't know a grown man who makes such direct requests, adminitions or even orders of his children. We dads sought validation from one another, or from other adults, peers.
I am, having been raised in the evangelical context, familiar with the Father God concept, although you r description clearly differs from their narrative.
But again, I say, my daughter doesn't have over 40,000 denominations of ideas to try and sort through, to figure out what I mean, and translations of translations of texts, and historical inaccuracies from the Roman empire, among a whole host of other things.
No, in point of fact, any man who wishes to be a present father is there, changing the diapers, picking up the toys, reading the bedtime stories, disciplining, helping with schoolwork and a whole host of other things. Not the least of which is apologizing when wrong. I know a generation or two back parents never apologized to their kids. It's a bit of humble pie, but I've done it more often than I care to count. No excuses, no blustering, just straight up apology. I don't need or want her worship. In fact, I am glad now that she is growing into a fine young woman, an adult of 20 now.
In fact, take this for point of consideration RE: belief. She follows the faith of her mother. When she asked if I wanted her to become atheist, my answer was not one of belief: I told her I'm much more concerned about how she lives her life, and the choices she makes, than I am about what belief she has or hasn't.
That makes rational, reasoned sense, especially since over the years I've done my utmost to provide her with at least the basics of critical thinking skills. I would think that if there is a god, that god would be far more interested in reasoned actions than s/he would be in belief in it.
There's an old Jewish tale of a father bird and 3 baby birds. The nest catches fire, so the father bird must move each baby, one by one, across the stream into the safety of a neighboring tree. He picks up the first bird, and starts to carry it across the stream. "When I get old, will you look after me? Will you honor me?" he asked the baby bird. "Yes," said the baby, "I'll always make sure you have the best place at my table. I'll live my life to honor you. I'll do nothing less than sing your praises." The father drops that baby bird into the stream and flies back for the second bird. On the way across the stream, he asks the same question: "When I get old, will you look after me? Will you honor me?" The bird replied: "I'll always make sure you have the best place at my table. I'll live my life to honor you. I'll do nothing less than sing your praises. In fact, I'll go out and tell all the other birds just how wonderful you are at loving and taking care of us."
The father dropped that bird into the stream and headed back across to pick up the final bird. He asked this final bird the same question.
"I don't know," said the baby bird. "What if I have baby birds, and their nest is on fire, and I need to carry them across the stream. I think I'll show my appreciation by how well I look after my own baby birds, and see that they have a good life, just as you did for us." And the father bird carried the baby bird to the safety of the neighboring tree, out of the way of the fire and smoke.
Of course, that is just a story, but that is actually how I feel as a father myself.